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Huge Antarctic ice chunk collapses

Joseph
Joseph's picture

Is this the beginning of what eco-scientists have been saying, a cyclical change, or something else?

http://www.cnn.com/2008/TECH/science/03/25/antartica.collapse.ap/index.html

 

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Submitted by Joseph on Tue, 03/25/2008 - 12:56.

Jeff Schultz
Re: Huge Antarctic ice chunk collapses

Ok Ok,

I was being facetious concerning CTYankees stand and viewpoint

My question is, what does shouting expletives from the rooftops about "gloomsday" accomplish? Yes, the mean average global temperature is rising and will probably continue to do so. Behavior modification and acclimation to the environment will be key if we are to survive as a species on Earth.

Running around like a chicken with your head cut off spewing diatribe and pointing fingers does nothing but cause hate and fear. What is needed is solutions to adjust , not accusations. We are all in this together, wether you like it or not.

Global equality and "brotherhood" must be attained to further the cause of species perpetuation.

Naida, by the way, CTYankee happens to be a Scientist in my book. He has contributed to "green" energy technology and for that I commend him. He just so happens to be analytical and looks at things from a different prospective than most, and for that can he be faulted?


Fri, 03/28/2008 - 16:07

Naida
Naida's picture
Re: Huge Antarctic ice chunk collapses

More people need to jump up and down and shoot diatribes of fear.
Perhaps that would cause a shift to a greater sense of reasonableness.
If it helps people understand the implications of the ice shelf
collapsing then all I have to say is hurrah - go run around little
headless chicken.

Seriously though. No need to scream that the sky is falling. Just
some decent critical thinking backed with scientific concern will
suffice just fine thank you.

Wake up and smell the coffee, and don't wait for the sky to fall. Do something about it now.

Naida


Fri, 03/28/2008 - 16:14

Jeff Schultz
Re: Huge Antarctic ice chunk collapses

 CTYankee,

How dare you trivialize such a catastrophic event? Where are your facts and why aren't you afraid like the rest of us? Valium? Qualudes? or just plain lack of common sense! Concerned!


Fri, 03/28/2008 - 13:08

bryan
Re: Huge Antarctic ice chunk collapses

This may be the most historic event that ever happened because this is just just " a big chunk of ice" Everyone really don't understand whats really happening to our "home"... This is HUGE!!! I am afraid we are running out of time to step up and accept whats happening to out planet. We cant worry about issue like War in Iraq, Terrorist, Jobs decling, and so forth.

This chunk of ice could have done more damage than you think!!! Hey, its not over yet, there still more CHUNK of ICE left. If we dont step up and take care of our "home", there will be nothing left to take care of. We gonna end up  like" WATERWORLD"... You think im silly to think that? Well, i'm not, just excting to see when this will happen again and SCARED!!! Face it our would is changing faster than you think.. Lets try and preserve our 'HOME"....

This is just another typical doomsday event.


Thu, 03/27/2008 - 22:04

ctyankee
Re: Huge Antarctic ice chunk collapses

Bryan,

  I want you to do an experiment.  Fill two straight water glasses with ice cubes, and put them on the counter. For this demo try to use the same number of roughly equal sized cubes, and don't let the ice go above the brim.

  In the first glass, holding down the cubes in the class i.e. keep them from floating (use a paper clip or something smaller than your finger).  I want you to fill the glass to the brim with cold tap water.   Then gently let the ice cubes go (no messes please). 

  In the second glass  we'll do a control experiment, fill the second glass to the brim with more cold tap water, but this time let the ice cubes float as you pour the water.  Try not to spill.

  For both glasses try to pour the water up to and even with the brim of the glasses, I know you could pour a big bulging meniscus on the water, but it has no bearing on the demonstration. 

 Now I want you to wait an hour or so until the ice is all melted.  Tell us where the water level in the glasses ends up.

  The point is that neither glass will overflow.  In fact both glasses will end up with water below the brim.  So Waterworld isn't gonna happen when floating ice melts in the ocean.

  My challenge to you is this.  Which glass ends up with more water in it after all the ice melts.


Sat, 03/29/2008 - 15:54

Naida
Naida's picture
Re: Huge Antarctic ice chunk collapses

You all are living in your own state of reality. The majority of scientists ARE greatly concerned about the ice shelf breaking. When you have a nice chunk of ice that splits into multple chunks doesn't it usually mean (when no force has been applied) that it has separated due to heat? You are in a make believe world if you want to think of this as normal cyclical activity. What are you basing the cyclic-ness to? Tree rings perhaps or ice samples taken miles down? Well, guess what, your same data for cyclical reasoning shows that this level of "cyclical-ness" has not happened before in history. Do you have some unique data source that you'd like to share with us that shows that the median of this cyclical-ness is "normal." Please share... I already know what you'll find because I've been reading the scientific journals, watching the press reports, and carefully analyzing both sides of the story. It is pure and simple not normal activity - the raise in temperature across the planet is not cyclically normal. I guess that you and some of the other naysayers won't believe it until the problem is right in your face at which point it wll be too late do do anything to rectify.

Naida


Thu, 03/27/2008 - 18:44

ctyankee
Re: Huge Antarctic ice chunk collapses

Hi Nadia,

  You nailed it 100% when you started to identify the force acting on the ice!  The force is gravity!  Heat, in the sense you're referring to it, would not have caused the ice to fracture.  Heat would have caused a trivial about of warming of the surface of the ice.

  What we see in the satellite images is a progressive cascading series of fractures of the glacier.  Remember the ice consists of nearly pure H20 crystals and interstitial brine.  It takes very little energy to cleave the crystals, and the cracks penetrate at high speed.

The brine also acts to lubricate the massive sections of ice as they calve off into the ocean.  Each chunk creates waves as it  enters the ocean, and alters the stress patterns in the shelf.  The combination of alternating strains and shifting stresses cause the entire mass to 'granulate' in a manner similar to the shattering of tempered glass.

I'm certain that no one who has ever seen tempered window shatter at an impact would assert the melting point of the window was a significant factor in the failure.


Sat, 03/29/2008 - 15:34

ctyankee
Re: Huge Antarctic ice chunk collapses

If the shelf 'collapsed' shouldn't we have all gotten a bit wet on or about the morning of Feb 29 ( 500 MPH x 9,000 miles).

Since we didn't, I'd conclude the ice was already floating on the ocean.  So what exactly is meant by collapse? 

A piece of the floating shelf separated from the bigger part of the floating shelf...  OMG, the big ice cube split into 2 smaller but equal ice cubes.

This is *not* the end of the world.  CNN (fear mongers that they are) erroneously invented a quote: "Scientists *worry* (emphasis mine) that it too may collapse."  No we don't!  It's cool that we get to watch something like this.

If anything, bringing that much ice north into the tropics will cool the atmosphere by just a smidgen.  Yep, it's cyclic, that's all.


Wed, 03/26/2008 - 12:44

dje43
Re: Huge Antarctic ice chunk collapses

So a chunk of ice broke off the Antarctica.

That is going to lessen the quality of life on planet Earth, how? and, when?

Also, the possible increase of temps at the Pole of 0.9 per decade over the past 5 decades. A possible increase of 4.5 degrees over a five decade period?

So now it's only 70 below zero, instead of -74.5?

It is no secret the planet has undergone Many cyclical changes throughout it's existence. And such changes will never cease to occur.

The so-called Changes in our planet that some people live in fear of, are not new....they are merely REoccurances.

Nothing we could possibly do would alter what is inevitable.

These comments notwithstanding, I highly respect what Ed does, and has done, to "green up" the earth. And to teach us all to be less dependant on others to provide our needs.

Ed doesn't just "talk".....he DOES!!

I had the great pleasure to meet Ed many years ago. I respect him as an Actor, a person, and as an eco-activist.

Dave Eaton


Tue, 03/25/2008 - 21:59